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Discussion in 'Off Topic' started by noeettica, Apr 12, 2011.
Ethanol Suxx Here's your chance to fix it !
Oh man those petitions ALWAYS work.
[movedhere] General Discussion [move by] iMacattack.
of coarse they do
I was having this discussion the other day with someone at work. Lets say we stopped using E10 today and went back to straight gas, that basically means we will be using 10% more gas which doesn't seem like much. Well that means demand for oil goes up quite a bit, problem is we are a supply and demand world and the 2 don't move in equal circles anymore. Especially in todays terms a 10% increase in demand can mean a jump at the pumps anywhere from 15-40%. So that means we can be paying as much as $6 a gallon just to get away from E10. I don't know about you, but I'd rather deal with E10 then anymore increases in fuel prices. And from a boating perspective I've never had an issue, just treat your gas and have a fuel filter/water seperator and you will be just fine.
How is repealing the excise tax on ethanol going to fix anything?
Repeal a $0.045 per gallon tax credit to fuel blenders (blenders are the only ones who get this credit on a quarterly basis) and watch the cost jump by a disproportionate amount for the same stuff. Take a dollar out of their pockets and they will find a way to charge an extra buck and a quarter.
The only reason this is getting any attention is because corn is currently around $7.50 a bushel and the farmers are making money faster than they can harvest it.
Ethanol is not a great energy source once you look at the cost of production, but at least we are trying to divert some of our money from the Middle East. We have to start somewhere. Other options might be better long term solutions, but ethanol falls in to our existing infrastructure. It pushes money toward Americans who will spend that money in their communities. Additionally it creates an environment where we are forced to explore other options.
...and U.S. farmers making money is a bad thing in what way? If the price of an AG commodity crashes, we don't just keep producing the commodity to give it to starving Third Worlders. Instead, farmers significantly decrease the the production of the commodity and try to find something the will make them money. The Third World will still be hungry.
I am not attacking you, Ducknut. You are just explaining the attention. The idea that some part of the population actually thinks that farmers are making too much money infuriates me. Modern AG is an economic shell game. A good farmer probably has a net worth of millions, but he can't touch most of that money because it is tied up in land and equipment that he must have to operate. You can't make ends meet with a 100 acre family farm anymore. Farmers take on hellacious debt every year to cover their operating costs just to end up making an average profit that wouldn't excite most of us. Sure, the boom years are pretty awesome, but the bad years would give me dry heaves. There is a reason that our grandparents got the hell off the farm after WWII.
Nate, no affront taken and this is why formus are such a great tool.
I 100% agree with you that small farmers are a thing of the past. I grew up in corn country and have friends that are farmers so I know more about the situation than most. Ethanol is the new disguised term for farm subsidies. But the bad thing about ethanol has been discussed many times and it does hurt not only our but the worlds economies as a whole.
I was not trying to infuriate anyone merely pointing out that repealing the blenders tax credit is not even a start to the solution. And you are exactly right on the annual cycle of the "days of the farmers lives".
Sounds like you have farming in your blood?
My parents have my mom's family place and one day I'll buy it from them. I'd like to farm exclusively, but I wouldn't be able to handle the stress. I'll always have another job to make ends meet so I can sleep at night. Once I retire for the second time I might be able to be a serious hobby farmer.
I agree. Ethanol is a subsidy in disguise and it will require some serious leaps in production technology to become cost effective (from our perspective/Brazil has found a way to live with it). However, oil primarily comes from a countries with "issues", solar and wind are cute, but inadequate and hydrogen is still a long way off. Our U.S. reserves will help, but they won't wean us off the Middle East teat. No one over there is our friend nor are they stable. We've got to start looking for alternatives even if it is painful.