Great insight Chris very interesting stuff. Chris can you elaborate on what the feeling difference is between the original whipray and the waterman you mentioned. thanks
The difference between the Whiprays and all the other hulls built using its hull shape is simple.
They are engineered and marketed differently.
To explain the differences let’s get the names strait first.
The Whipray skiff design stands totally on its own in its original design configuration with an all cored hull, Kevlar skin option that everyone ordered, a full deck with two main hatches and a small baitwell hatch aft.
It had 3 options for steering with the side console it’s first run, then tiller, and eventually a center console.
The floor came standard but could be left out if wanted.
When I came up with what now is most widely known as the Waterman skiff the idea was to use the Whiprays great hull shape and match it with a less costly build both to us the builders and to provide a less expensive skiff to the public.
The Waterman skiff evolved with many name changes starting as the Skate, with other names like the Mosquito Lagoon and then the Waterman skiff.
Tom Gordon bought the Waterman molds after I sold out and renamed theses molds after himself.
So just look at the Gordon skiffs being built using Hells bays molds but built to Toms standards.
Now after this happened someone to me screwed up and to give clout to lesser builds started calling every small skiff at Hells Bay a “Whipray....Waterman,” or “Whipray Pro”.
It’s gotten people very confused because they think they have the Whipray build standard but in reality it was a bait and switch and what they really have is a Waterman build. She might be your momma but he ain’t your daddy kinda thing.
The Watermans build differs in what is left out compared to the Whiprays build. To be cost effective and to show great distinction between the 2 brands I built the Waterman skiffs using 1-1/2 matt and 18oz roving in a hull that had a rolled sheer flange. The core in the hulls only went up to the hulls sides. I needed the core to stiffen the bottom but it was not needed in the topsides. This was to be a basic skiff so a bit of wobble was no big deal.
The rest of the skiff was built like the Whiprays. This type of build without a floor felt when running like a regular skiff. Not as stiff. To me for the price it’s in its simplest build shape the best skiff out there for the $.
But ...... it does not feel anywhere as nice as a full deck floored Whipray when running through a good chop.
Whiprays feel like a real yacht, Watermans feel like a skiff.
The price difference at the time was $21,000.00 for a Whip verse $9850.00 for the Waterman.
Everyone wanted the Watermans price but the Whiprays build. Hence the bait and switch later on with adding the Whiprays name to lesser skiffs builds. Both great skiffs weather built by HB or Tom Gordon.
I feel the mistake lots builders have made is to keep trying to compete with the Whiprays mystique instead of looking at what a whole lot of the public can really afford. Outboard manufacturers could care less what the engine is hanging on. Same as the hardware, glass people.
Mel and Erin have figured it out though. So has Harvey Geen.
Beaver tail made a direct splash off a Pros hull. They lost the copyright suit but to my 2and hand knowledge HB had to pay them a good sum to destroy the molds. Too much competition.
HB also bought out Tom because of the competition and confusion.
I would have never spent a cent on either, just would have kept on building to my specs and kept up my customer relations.
To build a splash don’t copy the hull exactly. Just add to it’s length by an inch and add a styling change to it.
On the Whipray hull just extend the lower reverse spray strake by 4-5”. Now you have a different design.
The Whiprays hull was designed by me before Hells Bay was started. I handed my design to Hal and we started HB. Because it’s hull shape was never copyrighted in its first year its always been known as “ public knowledge”.
Lots of skiffs out here today have borrowed ideas from past skiffs. I for one write about my history of past influences.
I feel all my designs are very original though, and I feel in the market place today that the new Beavertails are totally original designs too along with Harvey’s.